@joefortier.bsky.social
IT guy with rather too much political focus
It's a little weird, that this is the post that gets a response. I'm sure it's the "Genocide Joe" reference, which at least partially supports my concerns (about amplification, not inherently about manipulation).
February 16, 2025 at 7:12 PM
It's a little weird, that this is the post that gets a response. I'm sure it's the "Genocide Joe" reference, which at least partially supports my concerns (about amplification, not inherently about manipulation).
Sure... I'm just reflecting on my own responses.
There's an undertone I'm pick up on... I'm probably a "liberal". I'm not sure that's a bad thing, but for some it seems so (particularly from friends with... stronger positions).
But that's tangential, and I'm recording how the idea formed for me.
There's an undertone I'm pick up on... I'm probably a "liberal". I'm not sure that's a bad thing, but for some it seems so (particularly from friends with... stronger positions).
But that's tangential, and I'm recording how the idea formed for me.
February 16, 2025 at 7:10 PM
Sure... I'm just reflecting on my own responses.
There's an undertone I'm pick up on... I'm probably a "liberal". I'm not sure that's a bad thing, but for some it seems so (particularly from friends with... stronger positions).
But that's tangential, and I'm recording how the idea formed for me.
There's an undertone I'm pick up on... I'm probably a "liberal". I'm not sure that's a bad thing, but for some it seems so (particularly from friends with... stronger positions).
But that's tangential, and I'm recording how the idea formed for me.
I'm not really talking about actual protest, but the online, much cheaper sort. It's different here, and I don't think we've really adjusted to it. Much like the dawn of the book, it will take decades before we've really assimilated this new world.
February 16, 2025 at 7:04 PM
I'm not really talking about actual protest, but the online, much cheaper sort. It's different here, and I don't think we've really adjusted to it. Much like the dawn of the book, it will take decades before we've really assimilated this new world.
Are you suggesting then that i am wrong to think this way, that there is no such (fairly simple) manipulation going on. Or merely that I do not know. Follow-up, if I do not know, is there something wrong with posting this?
February 16, 2025 at 6:47 PM
Are you suggesting then that i am wrong to think this way, that there is no such (fairly simple) manipulation going on. Or merely that I do not know. Follow-up, if I do not know, is there something wrong with posting this?
I'm not a reporter. Yes it's my intuition, and you are free to reject it.
It doesn't even have to involve active manipulation, the core idea is that we're "wired" (by culture at the very least) to overweight feedback when it can happen at the scale that social media allows.
It doesn't even have to involve active manipulation, the core idea is that we're "wired" (by culture at the very least) to overweight feedback when it can happen at the scale that social media allows.
February 16, 2025 at 6:39 PM
I'm not a reporter. Yes it's my intuition, and you are free to reject it.
It doesn't even have to involve active manipulation, the core idea is that we're "wired" (by culture at the very least) to overweight feedback when it can happen at the scale that social media allows.
It doesn't even have to involve active manipulation, the core idea is that we're "wired" (by culture at the very least) to overweight feedback when it can happen at the scale that social media allows.
You seemed to have missed my main point, the role of SM in amplifying and manipulating dissent That's probably my fault... and probably because I brought up a trigger issue to frame it around.
February 16, 2025 at 6:25 PM
You seemed to have missed my main point, the role of SM in amplifying and manipulating dissent That's probably my fault... and probably because I brought up a trigger issue to frame it around.
It's not much of a stretch to believe that this is now deliberately cultivated.
/Fin
#wordy_joe #political_joe
/Fin
#wordy_joe #political_joe
February 16, 2025 at 5:52 PM
It's not much of a stretch to believe that this is now deliberately cultivated.
/Fin
#wordy_joe #political_joe
/Fin
#wordy_joe #political_joe
In social media space 10 people is (almost literally) "nothing", trivially small, but it's extremely hard for us to see that in perspective. We're not wired that way, and we've not developed the cultural defenses against this.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:51 PM
In social media space 10 people is (almost literally) "nothing", trivially small, but it's extremely hard for us to see that in perspective. We're not wired that way, and we've not developed the cultural defenses against this.
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We as people are biased toward small scale consensus. Our natural social space is about 150 or so people, and in such a space dissent of one person is barely significant, but dissent of ten people is enormous.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:50 PM
We as people are biased toward small scale consensus. Our natural social space is about 150 or so people, and in such a space dissent of one person is barely significant, but dissent of ten people is enormous.
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I've read a number of critiques of titter in particular (but I think the general ideas apply to all social media to some degree) that emphasize how powerful "numbers" and immediacy were/are for for the journalists and policy people on social media.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:50 PM
I've read a number of critiques of titter in particular (but I think the general ideas apply to all social media to some degree) that emphasize how powerful "numbers" and immediacy were/are for for the journalists and policy people on social media.
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I do not think these sorts of strategies need to be "evil mastermind" conceptions, but instead "found" by looking at how things work in practice and then working out strategies to influence how discussion plays out.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:50 PM
I do not think these sorts of strategies need to be "evil mastermind" conceptions, but instead "found" by looking at how things work in practice and then working out strategies to influence how discussion plays out.
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This also has the effect of making folks who might otherwise be on the fence, make the jump to committing to a more fringish take.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:49 PM
This also has the effect of making folks who might otherwise be on the fence, make the jump to committing to a more fringish take.
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A simple technique, that I'd totally expect, an "AI" (LLM) powered army of bot posters can take real, but marginal views, and make them appear to be held by a much larger group of folks.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:49 PM
A simple technique, that I'd totally expect, an "AI" (LLM) powered army of bot posters can take real, but marginal views, and make them appear to be held by a much larger group of folks.
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Amplifying "Genocide Joe" served political purposes, both for Republicans, but also some (I'd argue overly zealous) section of the left. Now that the election is over, that need has evaporated. Some of this is natural, but it doesn't take much of a leap to see the easy potential for manipulation.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:48 PM
Amplifying "Genocide Joe" served political purposes, both for Republicans, but also some (I'd argue overly zealous) section of the left. Now that the election is over, that need has evaporated. Some of this is natural, but it doesn't take much of a leap to see the easy potential for manipulation.
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Thinking about this in terms of social media, and I can see some similar patterns. I do not think there needs to be any overarching scripting that the Putin analysis suggests. Instead I think it is simpler, where useful bits of narrative get amplified for some directed ends.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:47 PM
Thinking about this in terms of social media, and I can see some similar patterns. I do not think there needs to be any overarching scripting that the Putin analysis suggests. Instead I think it is simpler, where useful bits of narrative get amplified for some directed ends.
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At least according to this take, dissent ends up as a somewhat scripted "call and response" dialogue carefully managed to further the aims of the Russian state. I'm hardly an expert on Russian politics, but this picture seemed reasonably convincing to me.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:47 PM
At least according to this take, dissent ends up as a somewhat scripted "call and response" dialogue carefully managed to further the aims of the Russian state. I'm hardly an expert on Russian politics, but this picture seemed reasonably convincing to me.
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Opposition groups were not only allowed to exist, but were even funded, with the aim of encouraging some responses and discouraging others.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:46 PM
Opposition groups were not only allowed to exist, but were even funded, with the aim of encouraging some responses and discouraging others.
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Got to thinking about an article I read a while ago, a fascinating account of how Putin re-worked how the Soviet's responded to dissent. Instead of harsh suppression, Putin "managed" dissent with the intent of controlling the narrative to his ends.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:45 PM
Got to thinking about an article I read a while ago, a fascinating account of how Putin re-worked how the Soviet's responded to dissent. Instead of harsh suppression, Putin "managed" dissent with the intent of controlling the narrative to his ends.
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That feels really off to me, unlike actual protest, which is costly on numerous levels, online jibes are almost cost free, and I expect far more of them directed to Trump in the fashion they were directed against Biden.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:45 PM
That feels really off to me, unlike actual protest, which is costly on numerous levels, online jibes are almost cost free, and I expect far more of them directed to Trump in the fashion they were directed against Biden.
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Before the election I saw this constantly, including from people I know. It really does seem odd to me that I see so little equivalent rhetoric directed at Trump.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:45 PM
Before the election I saw this constantly, including from people I know. It really does seem odd to me that I see so little equivalent rhetoric directed at Trump.
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The trigger was reading some discussion about the lack of anti trump protest over Gaza. That critique resonates with me, but I'm realizing that my reaction is not any actual protest I'm not seeing, but the cheap and easy online "protest" of "Genocide Joe" slurs.
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February 16, 2025 at 5:44 PM
The trigger was reading some discussion about the lack of anti trump protest over Gaza. That critique resonates with me, but I'm realizing that my reaction is not any actual protest I'm not seeing, but the cheap and easy online "protest" of "Genocide Joe" slurs.
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FWIW, this attitude reeks of the "10X programmer" elitist nonsense to me (and I think there's a lot of it in the valley)
February 4, 2025 at 4:27 PM
FWIW, this attitude reeks of the "10X programmer" elitist nonsense to me (and I think there's a lot of it in the valley)